tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7084921087677216126.post6144498028319860233..comments2023-08-12T17:27:01.102+02:00Comments on The Pink Pigtail Inn: Moderation and addictionLarísahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05769822260333419777noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7084921087677216126.post-62177650728470963002008-07-19T16:21:00.000+02:002008-07-19T16:21:00.000+02:00wow. Its really interesting that you wrote about t...wow. Its really interesting that you wrote about the "gray" specifically like I did. I'm following your links to other people's posts about this, I hadn't seen them before. Thanks for putting your story out there. I really appreciate the honesty here.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7084921087677216126.post-81894547097873553012008-06-28T14:39:00.001+02:002008-06-28T14:39:00.001+02:00Posted by: Larísa Oh many ideas here worth explori...Posted by: Larísa <BR/>Oh many ideas here worth exploring a bit more. Maybe in another post later on. But it IS quite hard to write about those issues, I've found. <BR/><BR/>The whole area feels a bit... sensitive. Infected. If you get what I mean. "Addiction" sometimes is just a perogative word, coming from an outsider's perspective, just judging gamers out of prejudices. Therefore just admitting there may be problems about excessive WoW playing makes me feel like one of those "outsiders". Which I'm definitly not. <BR/><BR/>And I if anyone really love the social dimension of the game and it enrichens my life in many ways. <BR/>But it's hard to discuss it in a balanced way without threading on too many toes. <BR/><BR/>Same thing about the old "casual" versus "hardcore" discussion... I usually call myself casual but slowly I've started to realize I actually may seem a bit hardcore in the eys of some people. Maybe the terms aren't that useful after all. <BR/><BR/>I guess there is quite a difference though between people who are raiding - casually or not - and people who are not. Raiding usually takes your whole attention for hours, making you completely unavailable for the surroundings, which I guess may give quite a addicted impression. If you're just questing peacefully for yourself, collecting stuff and so on, you can take a break any minute for taking care of dishes, comforting children, aswereing the phone and so on. And the non-gamers probably won't see you as quite as addicted. <BR/><BR/>Looking forward to read your first blog post!<BR/><BR/>2008-06-26 @ 16:38:30Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7084921087677216126.post-8528280841367837432008-06-28T14:39:00.000+02:002008-06-28T14:39:00.000+02:00Posted by: 2ndNin Thats the other side of the addi...Posted by: 2ndNin <BR/>Thats the other side of the addiction, is there ever an end to a game with no real end point, the closest you could get is completing every quest, and killing Kil'jaden, but then you can do it on another class (8 more goes!), with a different spec...... <BR/><BR/>I would say that killing Kil'jaden is indeed the "end" of the game, but only in the same way Illidan was, he presents the ultimate challenge in the game, but he may not be your , or indeed anyone's final objective. The question I think is not really can you complete the game, as the nature of it denies you the completion that a single player or group game allows, but rather have you completed all your goals in the game... <BR/><BR/>WoW strangely offers us choices, not all 100% understandable from any other perspective though. In many ways a game like this is in fact not so much an addiction as a whole social sphere, people rarely complain if you go out and meet friends every night after work, yet playing wow a similar amount is an addiction. I wonder how the casual-raider, who often spends as long as a hardcore raider in a less focused manner, sees themselves and their play time? <BR/><BR/>Thank you for the welcome though, :P might post more.<BR/><BR/>2008-06-26 @ 15:44:59 <BR/>URL: http://2ndNin.blogspot.comAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7084921087677216126.post-13473282171498251592008-06-28T14:38:00.000+02:002008-06-28T14:38:00.000+02:00Posted by: Larísa Hm... you've already written you...Posted by: Larísa <BR/>Hm... you've already written your first blog post, just that you write it in the form of a comment on mine... Not that I mind though! It's just excellent to get a really good guest writer like you in here! <BR/><BR/>I'll definitly try to move your comment to my new home http://pinkpigtailinn.blogspot.com so it won't get lost in cyberspace (I'm in the process of moving the entire blog unless you've noticed). <BR/><BR/>Anyway... do you really think you'll feel that you've finished the game once you've done the last instance? I wonder. When it comes to me I feel that I by only knowing and playing one class (mage) just see a part of the game. I've never been on the horde side. I've never been on a PvP or RP server. I've never played healer or tank... Even if it the impossible would happen, that Larísa did the last boss in Sunwell, I think I'd find plenty of new challanges in the game to deal with. And anyway - after all it's just a sort of very advanced and good-looking chat program... In one way. <BR/><BR/>By the way, playing pala seems complicated. Playing arcane mage means mainly mashing one single button: arcane blast... And then some iceblock or cold snap when needed. Most of my cd:s are in a macro... still I can't really say I think it's easy. Every fight which includes a lot of moving around is a big challange to me actually. But I guess it tells more about my level of newbishness than anything else. <BR/><BR/><BR/>2008-06-26 @ 13:45:11Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7084921087677216126.post-89299421290772700092008-06-28T14:37:00.001+02:002008-06-28T14:37:00.001+02:00Posted by: 2ndNin :P Thats the hard bit, so much t...Posted by: 2ndNin <BR/>:P Thats the hard bit, so much to write, yet when I start I tend to delete things. <BR/><BR/>Its so weird really, irl, I don't do social well, yet WoW (and its likely the distance and way computer games operate, the distance and normalisation)I do, I like the experience. I tend to be a tank, and its a really nice feeling having people at your back (healers, dispellers, etc), your other tanks working with you. Its being part of a team, and knowing you can't let one person drop, you need to make sure everyone is there and working towards the same goal, and its done in a way most social or work environments aren't. <BR/><BR/>Social and work environments (discounting things like team sports etc which tend to be more like WoW than not, but things like going out, pubs etc) are people who are together and spending time, WoW, team sports etc bring together not only people interested in the same thing, but give you a real reason to not slack. There is a drive amidst a group of raiders, I thing Kil'jaden really summed it up, if 1 person dies or doesn't do their job its close to a wipe. That level of focus, and requirement to trust and work with your other players, even if you don't know them irl builds heavily on you and means you don't want to let them down. It is I would say even more vital in a game like WoW than it is in team sports, because the encounters are tuned for 25 people (pre-nerfs of course at the right gear level), not having 25 up makes them so much harder, most fights can accept a few losses, but everyone has to try to not be that loss. <BR/><BR/>I will admit to probably being addicted to WoW (:P, its fun and I like raiding, was guildless for 2 weeks and bored silly not doing it), however I don't think the game is really all that fun, as a tank my rotation is pretty fixed (I play a paladin, we don't have responses normally), but the additional elements, and the way they interact with the group make it fun, blood boil being the most recent example I can cite, my role is basically stand there, don't die, don't make too much threat (co-operation amongst tanks, normally most fights take a single tank and try and let the dps go aggro free). Its kindof odd, I basically hit the same 6 buttons or so in a rotation, move to avoid stuff, my whole point in the game is to make my 1 number bigger than anyone else's number, yet its fun. <BR/><BR/>I don't know how you can really treat an addiction like this, it really goes to the core of what it is to be human, to be needed, to be part of something and to be social. Indeed MMO's survive through that, I can't remember which blogger it was, but one noted that MMOs without community die, those with a sense of community live. Blizzard have the benefit of Lore and those that will play simple because its Blizzard or Warcraft, but that community aspect is the real addiction, and its access to 3million or so other subscribers in your game area, people willing to talk, to help, and to simply be there when you need to do something. LFM and LFG are always full of people, your guild is there, WoW is essentially a huge chat program with added monsters, and I have great admiration for people that can truly pull themselves out of it and tone it down to a level of a few hours or what ever, because the need to progress is a very strong draw in this game and mostly because of that social aspect. <BR/><BR/>:P ok, stupidly huge comment, not sure if it all makes sense, its hard to talk really about addiction in a game like this, where the nature of the game requires that addiction to progress well. There are guilds and people that don't, but for most of us, barring the truly casual, the drive to see the game means we need to play. I think Lich King will help this in a way, with 10 / 25s for every instance, there is the possibility of "finishing" the game with a relatively small group of people and in less time, its not to say that 10 man needs to be intrinsically easier than 25 man, but you have more control and less finely tuned instances meaning there is likely a path of lesser addiction, provided that completion of that path does not draw you down a huge end game path of re-doing the 25mans to achieve "finishing" the game.<BR/><BR/>2008-06-26 @ 11:20:46 <BR/>URL: http://2ndNin.blogspot.comAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7084921087677216126.post-25170684874200404002008-06-28T14:37:00.000+02:002008-06-28T14:37:00.000+02:00Posted by: Larisa 2ndNin I think you're quite on t...Posted by: Larisa <BR/>2ndNin I think you're quite on the spot. The team work is sometimes quite painful, but it's also magic. And you're comment is very relevant. Looking forward to see you start filling your blog with some nice posts... <BR/><BR/><BR/>2008-06-26 @ 08:00:54Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7084921087677216126.post-30210636807272766202008-06-28T14:36:00.001+02:002008-06-28T14:36:00.001+02:00Posted by: 2ndNin I would agree, raiding in and of...Posted by: 2ndNin <BR/>I would agree, raiding in and of itself is addictive. Its not really the content, most of that can be summarised as variations on a theme, you learn that theme, you win. What is addictive is the high stress and team work, Mount Hyjal, at least while you don't overgear it is wonderful, you have 15 mobs attacking you, huge damage, watching out for over aggro, etc, basically each 2 minute stretch is highly intense, you get to be part of something and you relax and let yourself play. <BR/><BR/>Not letting it become an addiction is actually hard, its not simply a case of saying I will raid x, or I will do x, there is always that drive to stay up and talk, to go once more to the vendor for that rare drop, or indeed to sneak in a fast kara for some badges. The game itself is not really at fault, it is possible to progress on very low weekly times (2x3hr raid nights can be done), what is hard is that we are drawn into it, the community aspect which makes the game is also addictive, you are drawn in, you support your community and they support you. <BR/><BR/>I don't really know the point of this comment, everyone either knows WoW is addictive, or dismisses it as it doesn't affect them. I will say though that the community aspect is really what drives the addiction not the content, if this was a single player game, or even 5 man, I would have killed Illidan, cleared Sunwell and put it aside, the fact that it is so open, that you are so dependent on others and they on you is what means you come back, I think it was mentioned on Matticus, Kil'jaden is tuned, if you move too soon you wipe, too late you don't have the dps to down him, that means you are driven by 24 other people, and that winning is an achievement even if it is just a game.<BR/><BR/>2008-06-25 @ 11:43:03 <BR/>URL: http://2ndNin.blogspot.comAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7084921087677216126.post-56797531577230313932008-06-28T14:36:00.000+02:002008-06-28T14:36:00.000+02:00Posted by: Dechion As with anything in life balanc...Posted by: Dechion <BR/>As with anything in life balance is the key. Everything has a price, both in game and in real life. The real trick is staying concious of what you are getting and what the price is. <BR/><BR/>Well said.<BR/><BR/>2008-06-25 @ 11:42:54 <BR/>URL: http://benameless.wordpress.com/Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com